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Kwame Johnson
I've benefited personally from mentorship as a young person who made bad decisions, went to prison when I was 17. I had a number of times and was able to get a second chance at life through mentorship, and I decided to dedicate my second chance at life to helping young people reach their full potential, not make the decisions are made, and be a defender of potential.

Mentoring is important to me because it helps young people make it out of poverty. And in my opinion, poverty is the biggest challenge we face in our country. Welcome to the UMGC podcast Unstoppable Stories with your host, Lauren Cardillo.

Lauren Cardillo
Today I'm joined by Kwami Johnson, who is now the CEO of Big Brothers Big Sisters Metro Atlantic Area, an author, a dad, and of course, a UMGC grad. Welcome, Kwami. Thanks for being here.

Kwame Johnson
Thanks for having me. Glad to be here. Good morning.

Lauren Cardillo
My first question is, I remember you saying, I think it was at homecoming that as a CEO, you are a defender of potential. And for those people who, like, have no idea what that means, what does that mean and to mean to you personally?

Kwame Johnson
Well, what it means to me is that everyone in particular kids have potential. And my thought is that as adults, it's our responsibility to defend their potential. Everybody. Yourself. Anyone that's watching this now, to get to where we've gotten to. We've had someone along the way defend our potential. In many ways, that's a mentor. And that is what I've been doing for most of my career is mentorship and different shapes of forms, but primarily with young people, helping them get to the next level by defending their potential.

So anyone who's mentoring someone, anyone who's leaning into young people, I consider you all, a defender of potential.

Lauren Cardillo
Why is that so important to you? Why is that something that strikes you so personally?

Kwame Johnson
Because I've benefited personally from mentorship as a young person who made bad decisions. Went to prison when I was 17. I had a number of times. And, was able to get a second chance at life through mentorship and, decided to dedicate my second chance at life to helping young people, reach their full potential, not make the decisions are made.

And be a defender of potential. Mentoring is important to me, because it helps young people make it out of poverty. And in my opinion, poverty is the biggest challenge we face in our country. It is affects everyone, across different, economic backgrounds, political backgrounds, race. Poverty is something that affects everyone in so many bad things come at it from crime and violence and drugs.

So, you know, I know through mentorship, that in our program in particular, 98% of our kids graduate high school and education is the fastest way out of poverty. 95% of with the criminal justice system. So mentorship is a solution to poverty, which I think is one of the most wicked challenges we face in our country.

Lauren Cardillo
For you, as you just said, you made it. You made a wrong turn. You grew up in a supportive family to parents who are educators, correct?

Kwame Johnson
Yes. Both my parents, mom and dad.

Lauren Cardillo
So what was what was the sort of, what was lacking or what distracted you to end up in prison? And then you're thinking, what am I going to do with my life? You know, had that happen?

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. Whenever I talked to parents in particular, I start off by telling them it's not your fault, right? Too often parents take on that responsibility, in particular for teenage and young adult children. When we leave our homes, it's up to us. The decisions we make and the friendships we make and the type of people we hang around and things we do.

You can come from the best home or the worst home. But when you, as a young person, leave out of that home, it's up to you to make the decisions you made so that that is what happened with me, and just made some bad decisions being around the wrong people. Nothing to do with my upbringing.

But what did help me is having a strong foundation to bounce back from a lot of young people who been through what I have been through don't have a strong support system, don't have the family structure to come home to, don't have defenders of potential, rooting for them to help them, make a comeback.

Lauren Cardillo
I remember when you were at home coming here, we talked about that Mark Twain quote, you know, where it's like, you know, the two important dates, you know, the day you were born and the day you figure out why you're here. Yeah. And that's something to figure it out in prison. Right?

Kwame Johnson
Yes, I figured it out. In solitary confinement. Probably the worst places anyone could be. 23 hours a day in a hole. But I met some young men, who their stories have, you know, been with me since then. And, them being through the situations they've been through and not having parents in their lives, not having supportive systems, made me think.

Okay, I got to figure out a way to make sure that this doesn't happen to anybody else. And that's where I found my passion. I didn't realize it at the time. I was a kid, and I was just trying to get through it. But in later in life, I figured it out. And it's interesting how God puts you through different situations to help you figure out what you're supposed to be doing.

Lauren Cardillo
How long? How long did you end up in prison for?

Kwame Johnson
A whole year. My senior year of high school. So I did my schoolwork in the mail. Became the first kid ever in the United States of America to take the SATs behind bars. Kind of a long story, but it's documented in my book called the Hope inside, and I picked that title. Actually, I, borrowed it from Oprah Winfrey.

She has a, quote where she talks about mentors bring hope. That's inside of us. Outside of us. So I went with the title the Hope inside. Subtitle. Harnessing the Power of Mentorship in Life and Career. But that's where where it all started. And it's really about, for me, helping young people reach their full potential and having hope.

Lauren Cardillo
Well, it's the occurred is sort of the same thing. Your potential, your hope. It's already there. You just have to figure out how to get it out. I, I did read the story you wrote about how you got the sat in in prison, and if you can do a short version of that, because I thought that was great persistence to try to make that happen.

Like what hoops did you have to jump through?

Kwame Johnson
Yeah, I didn't realize all of it at the time. I was really just trying to get a scholarship, to Hampton University because I was I was a track runner before I got in trouble. And, those opportunities went away. But Hampton was a university. Was going to give me an opportunity. But a part of me getting an NCAA track scholarship at that time, you had to not only take your seats, you had to pass your s.a.t.s.

And that's kind of hard. When you're in jail. So there was an opportunity called a furlough, which can be used in different ways in jail to go and work release, to go to a funeral. But it was using a as an incentive, to for good behavior. You could go home for 24 hours within two months of your release.

So I applied, not for 24 hours, but for eight hours to go to a test site and come back and, you know, and do the rest of my time. Unfortunately, they denied it. Which I think speaks a lot about how the criminal justice system works. In particular for people of color, because they had no reason.

I was a I was the nerd of the jail. I was doing my schoolwork, wasn't getting trouble working in the in the kitchen. All the things that others that got theirs approved weren't doing. So why did you single me out? To not approve it? So when that happened, I went to my cell, read the SAT College Board book, and there was a section in there for students with disabilities.

So I actually wrote a letter under that, exemption to get the tests administered on site. And, it didn't stop. They didn't stop with that. They tried to the day of, my test to do a shakedown of my unit to try to plant contraband on me. So that I would go back to solitary confinement and not be able to take my test.

But a young man named shank, who, most people would consider a throwaway to society based on his name and his background. But he actually took the blame for that, and allowed me to go take my SATs and become the first kid ever in America to do that.

Lauren Cardillo
So they gave it to you in the prison?

Kwame Johnson
Yeah.

Lauren Cardillo
So what was that like? I mean, they just, like, pulled you out until, like, the cafeteria and said, here's a proctor. And and, you know.

Kwame Johnson
You know, when you're in, in New York state, every state is different. But in New York State, you're a minor at 17. In Georgia, where I live now, in Atlanta, you're an adult at 17. So you wouldn't even have known me if the same situation had happened in Georgia, which is a whole nother conversation to have for another time.

But in your state, when you go to jail as a minor, you have to go to school every day. If you don't have your G.E.D. or a high school phone. So you go to school and their goal is to get you to take your your GED. I didn't want to do that. I wanted to graduate high school, which is another thing I was able to do.

I graduated with my class with a high school diploma, not a G.E.D.. So they administered in the class, the same way they would administer genie test in the jail.

Lauren Cardillo
And then you got the letter there that said you passed.

Kwame Johnson
I got it. Later, I can't remember. All is 20 something years ago now, but I got it. They sent it to my house, and then that was the, like, the last step for me to get eligibility for a scholarship.

Lauren Cardillo
I love that. I mean, it's such a story of, like, you just kept persisting, like, I can make this happen.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. And I made history. And, you know, I tell people when you're trying to, you don't you don't try to make history. You just try to go about making change and doing something that you're passionate about in history will come along with that. I had no idea, you know, I didn't know anybody had not done that before. I was just trying to get my life back at that point and, get up, get to college.

Lauren Cardillo
So you end up at Hampton, and then you decide maybe that's not the best place for me. What was what was sort of the thought process thing and then got you to D.C. to work with a nonprofit.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. So when I was there, I met a guy named Bob Woodson. Robert L Woodson, a civil rights leader. Amazing body of work. And he was speaking at the university, and I had at that time, I wasn't doing well at Hampton, I was struggling. You know, it was a big transition from jail to college.

And wasn't as focused as I should be. And that's why UMBC was actually a better fit for me. When I when I got to D.C.. But, I told him my story, long story short, and, he was doing work with gangs and helping kids get out of gangs and helping, communities who were struggling with violence, through different types of mentoring programs and other programs.

And he said, hey, you know, why don't you come up and work for me in DC? And at the time I was like 19 or 20, and I had, you know, call my parents and tell them, hey, I'm leaving Hampton after all this work it took to get there. And, they were like, they didn't agree with it.

Really? I can't remember all the details, but, yeah, I went to DC and started working for the center for Neighborhood Enterprise under Bob Woodson's leadership, and stayed with him for seven years. But that got me to DC and a part of that, deal was that I would go to school at night and finish my degree.

Lauren Cardillo
So you're you're working by day with kids who are trying to find a way out of this, and at night you're, like, taking business classes or whatever it was and did that sort of, it's not a contradiction. But at that academy sort of fit you sometimes.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. It was what was interesting about it was I was doing work in DC. I was doing work in Atlanta. I was doing work in LA. I was doing work in Baltimore. Chicago. I was in a lot of cities. So I got a chance to see all the different challenges different cities were facing. And what I realized is that they're all the same challenge, the history, maybe different.

And that was the only difference. But what I learned was that young people, if given hope, can push through the most challenging situations. And hope in many ways came through individuals that we called human antibodies. So, you know, when you go to the doctors, if you're sick, typically the doctor will first try to help you strengthen your immune system.

Then they'll go to medicine, then they'll go to surgery. And Bob's approach was to start with people in the community who had already been doing good work, who were creating change, who were helping people get into college, helping people get off drugs, helping people get out of gangs. All these different things happen in communities every day. We just don't hear about it on the news.

And they're typically people who don't wear a title like mine and Big Brothers and Sisters. Typically there's somebody in the neighborhood who people turn to when they're in need. So whenever I go to a city, I go to a barbershop, I go to a hair salon, I go to a local church, I go and I ask them, where do you go to when you need help?

And then I go talk to those people and it has those same questions, but those are human antibodies that exist in communities every day that overlooked, that are doing change. And that is what was interesting for me going to school at night. But then also being around these human antibodies every day in different cities was pretty special.

Lauren Cardillo
It sounds like it was very positive, very encouraging.

Kwame Johnson
Yes, because I met other people like me, and I didn't realize that at the time. I didn't realize there were people like me. Yeah.

Lauren Cardillo
Was that with that sort of that moment where you realized, like you said, you know, when you were in prison, you realized you had to figure out what you were going to be, but now the moment is that is what I want to be.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. This is what I want to be. I want to be a human antibody. I want to be a defender of potential. And I'm comfortable with my story. That was a big part. You know, when you've been in jail, you come out with this stigma, especially as a black guy with a bald head and a few muscles.

So you walk through life, you know, worrying if someone's fearful of you and this, all these different things you carry. But Bob had a way of, showing us that you have that you still have value in society, even though you made mistakes and that that story is actually your superpower. And that's what I've leaned into my whole career.

That is actually been a superpower for me when I want. So something that may be negative about me.

Lauren Cardillo
So the things that people saw maybe as a negative, you've turned into a positive.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah, I turn a turn into a story. I turned it into a book. I turned it into a career. It's part of who I am, my story.

Lauren Cardillo
Are there are there kids along the way that you've met that you remember really vividly about how you helped turn things around or their story or something like that that sticks with you?

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. Outside of my door, there is a picture of a little in a big, in, in Stephen as the little. And Mike is, is big. And there's a picture of him graduating high school and then going to Harvard University like his big dad, his mentor graduating from Harvard, and then also now becoming a big brother to a young person in the program.

So it's like a full circle moment for a little young person who grew up in a tough environment to get a mentor, go to college, go to the same college, go to Harvard, graduate now as a mentor in the program. So there's stories, young people I meet every day. Who push through, something in our now, you know, reaching their full potential.

Lauren Cardillo
How does that make you feel?

Kwame Johnson
This feel good? That's that's what gives me, my fuel to do this work. I've been in youth development nonprofit for 20, over 20 years now, and it's not easy work. You know, every day you're dealing with challenges that families have and you're dealing with just what's going on in the nonprofit sector now, in the government and all the different things that come at us in this space.

So that is my fuel. And now, you know, doing this alone, my focus is not necessarily children. It's my staff who support the children in the mentors, the bigs who support the children. That is really in the role I am in today. But nearly 100 people who work for me, they make it. That matches happen.

They make the work happen, they do the mentorship, and they support all the 3000 kids that we support here in Atlanta. Metro. That this year.

Lauren Cardillo
Once again, you're listening to Kwami Johnson on Unstoppable Stories. If you want to hear more stories like Kwami, don't forget to like or subscribe on your favorite podcast channel. Going back to what you just said, Kwame, did you ever think I'm going to manage like a $9 million budget? 100 employees help 3000 kids? Was that ever in your, like vision?

Kwame Johnson
No it wasn't. My initial prayer in solitary was a simple prayer. And, you know, we'll make this about faith and that type of thing. But my simple prayer was that I don't I hope no one else has to go through this situation. That was like it was a simple thing, but I felt it to like my bones because, you know, being in solitary, I had grown men, crying for their mom every night on this side.

I had grown men barking like dogs on this side. And I'm like, am I going to lose my mind? I don't know, like, how do we determine if you if you keep your mind, you don't some God bless me to keep my mind. So that was a it was a simple prayer. I don't want anybody else to go through this situation.

And that is turned into this whole career. You know, when I was working for Bob, he model for me what a CEO looked like. He model for me. What getting comfortable with your story looked like. So I said, you know what I want? I want to do that one day. I want to run my own nonprofit one day.

And that is when I decided to start making some strategic moves in my career to learn how to fundraise, learn how to run programs so that I could be a CEO one day. But it didn't start that way. It just kind of all came together over time.

Lauren Cardillo
What did, what did Bob think of your like, your evolution.

Kwame Johnson
I think is, I think bittersweet. I think Bob wanted me to stay with him, forever. And what I tell you about, what I say about giants. Who? Bob is the giant giants cast big shadows. And, at some point you want to move from that shadow. So I think it was bittersweet. I think he's proud of me and what I'm doing now, but, I think he might have preferred me to stay with him, but this was my.

This is my path.

Lauren Cardillo
What's the biggest challenge in the sense of running Big Brothers? Big Sisters? Is it finding the mentors? Is it is it outreach? Is it fundraising? What is it that you know is your challenge every day?

Kwame Johnson
Yes, fundraising. And it's, finding dollars and finding because that's what I always say. Right. So fundraising of course. In particular in this climate where everyone's kind of pulling back and there's a lot of uncertainty across corporate foundation, individuals, government, but also volunteerism. I think is changing in America. I think younger generations, want to do more one off engagements, go clean apart, go paint a building.

And those are all great things. But my pitch has always been to people, leaders of any age. If you want to make your city better, you need to focus on helping young people get out of high school. That is like the one single thing, I continue to preach in particular kids that, are further away from opportunity.

We all have opportunity, but there's some people in a in America that are further from opportunity and that is my goal is to help them get out of high school. But now a lot of the volunteers don't want to be a big for a year. That's what we ask. They may want to be a big for a day.

So we're looking at how we can accommodate people and engage them where they are. You know, baby boomers, they'll be a big for ten years, 20 years. I have tons of stories of baby boomers who, where the big were. The little head was in their wedding, and now they're in their wedding, you know, and I just don't see this.

I've had bigs and littles open businesses get together. I dunno if that's a good idea or not, but, you know, the millennials and I think the younger generations, they see volunteerism different. So we as a society I think have to meet them where they are and figure out ways to engage them in mentorship in ways that makes sense for them.

Lauren Cardillo
Yeah. You've got to sort of find a new blueprint, you know, that works.

Kwame Johnson
Exactly.

Lauren Cardillo
How you how did how did you end up with the CEO job? I'm just curious what was like the process.

Kwame Johnson
So, after being in DC for ten years, roughly, said, you know, it and I've worked a few was with Bob for seven. I went to communities in schools and other big nonprofit, doing work, helping kids stay in school and not dropping out. And I said, you know what? Now I'm ready to be a CEO. A leader.

And, I looked at a few opportunities and one came up, opened in Atlanta for an organization called Palmer Learning, and there was an executive director role. That title is interchangeable in nonprofit executive director, typically for smaller nonprofits and then CEO for, you know, midsize and larger nonprofits. So I got that opportunity, got me to Atlanta to help do work in schools.

And then, almost eight years ago now, Big Brothers, Big Sisters reached out to me, about an opportunity and, yeah, the rest is history.

Lauren Cardillo
I love that. What what are your, what are your parents think now?

Kwame Johnson
They're they're proud. You know, they, I think they're still not 100% comfortable with me telling my story. I think there's just the parent, the protective parent in them, but they see what it has created. For me, it's created a whole lane, a whole career, for me. So I think they they see that it all worked out, and they're super proud of me.

They were actually just here for my son's, 13th birthday, so, it was good to see them.

Lauren Cardillo
Does it? Does your son like. Dad, don't don't preach to me.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. You know, like, you know, teenagers are, you know, but, yeah, he but he's along for the journey, so he gets to see a lot of the work that I'm doing. And hopefully he'll do that at some, you know, in some shape or form as he becomes an adult.

Lauren Cardillo
Now you're you're also not just dealing with kids. You do. You run like a men's group every couple of weeks. You guys meet.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. This you meet here this afternoon. This evening they meet here every third Tuesday and it's called.

Lauren Cardillo
What is that about?

Kwame Johnson
It's it's a it's a safe space for men to come in to talk about things that are on their mind. You know, men face a lot of silent, quiet challenges. And we wanted to create a space for them to work through those things. It's not therapy. We call it therapeutic. And we we always have a speaker on a different topic, whether it be finances or health, mental health and, but really a safe place for men to come and talk, who may not be in therapy or who can't afford therapy.

But then it is also an opportunity for us to recruit men and particularly men of color, which is hard. The hardest group of men for us to recruit. For mentors, we have a few hundred kids waiting for mentors here in Allen. We have 10,000 waiting across the country. So that is a big pitch to your audience.

If you're in any city and you want to give back and make your city better, sign up to be a mentor, whether it's with us or somebody else. But point to the next generation.

Lauren Cardillo
Because I love your message that education is the way to your way out. You know, and I think if more mentors saw that, more people saw that, they would be like, oh, I should do this.

Kwame Johnson
Yes. And there's actually a lot of research on the benefit that many mentors get out of mentoring. So we know that mentors have better health outcomes. So we know mentors do better on their jobs. We know mentors earn more. So there's this magic that happens when you pour into someone else. You actually pour it into yourself. And anytime I talk to a big or a mentor in our program, the first thing they say to me is they've gotten more out of this than they put in.

That is that is the common thing they always say, hands down.

Lauren Cardillo
So for anyone watching or listening, tell me what a job description of a mentor is like. What would the person have to do?

Kwame Johnson
They would just have to be someone that cares about young people. And that's the myth, right? The myth is that a mentor is is adoption. The the myth is that mentorship is something I'm not good enough for yet those are all myths in particular. For men. You are good enough just the way you are. If you are safe for kids and you want to spend eight hours a month helping again person, that is the only job description.

We take care of the rest. We train you. We support you. You get a coach with our team once you get matched to walk with you through the life of the match, we give you ideas, plans, troubleshoot all those different things. So, we say it takes little to be big. So I always try to combat the myths that I don't have the time.

I'm not good enough. You know, those are things that we all, we all can we all can do it. And it's not about creating new time. None of us have time to create new time. But it's about how do you incorporate this young person in your existing time? We all go to the grocery store. We all go to the park.

You know, these are these are outings. You know that a young person come along with you and actually learn something through a conversation. So it's it's it's you can be do big by being little. It does not take, some big act. It's not adoption or so these type of things. It's it's something we all can do.

Lauren Cardillo
So. So what what would people find themselves doing, like you said, like go to the park, go to the grocery store. What other common things would a mentor do?

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. So when I signed up to do it, which is a whole nother story because Shanks real name is Anthony. And, I got matched with a young man named Anthony. He was a at the time, and, my son was eight at the time, and we would, you know, every other weekend I would call his mom and go pick him up for a few hours.

We go to the park, we go to outings, we go to the games, we go to the jump park. Or we just have a conversation over a meal, a chick, a, you know, these are all just simple routine things. Couple calls throughout the week. Just checking out on see how you doing in school. But that is what it was.

It was just that it was not some huge thing. And kids, you know, a lot of they, you know, particular kids who are in low income communities, they really just need to see what's possible. You know, I was talking to some pastors, recently, and I was they were asking about why kids don't go to church and how we get some more kids to go to church.

And I was telling them, the kids don't want to hear a sermon. They want to see one. They want a living, tangible example of what's possible. And in any way that you can just show up and just tell them what you do and how you did it. In many ways, we as leaders in this country are aliens to a lot of young people in America.

And if we would just show up, give them hope, give them an example of what's possible. That's a lot of ways. That's all it takes.

Lauren Cardillo
Are you still in contact with with little Anthony?

Kwame Johnson
I haven't talked to in a few. They moved out of town. But I did hear that he's doing well in school and he's doing good. So. And that's the thing these relationships can be for a year, a few years, just leaning in to help a young person to make a huge difference and plant those seeds for later in life.

Lauren Cardillo
So did you sort of think there was a trend here with the Anthony's?

Kwame Johnson
Yeah, I don't know, like we'll see what's next. Right. But you know, you know Anthony Anthony and you know so but I think God gives you nudges along the way to let you know you're on the right track. And I think that's what that was for me.

Lauren Cardillo
I read that in something that you had reconnected with Anthony or Shank. Yeah. And so tell me how that went, you know, and how that felt.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. It took a while. Like, it really was people when I would, speak, they would always ask about him. Right. So I said, let me I don't even know his real name. Let me try to figure out where he is. And I asked around and on Facebook. Right. You know, that helps you reconnect with everybody, you know.

So, reached out on Facebook, learned that he was in Richmond, now running a business, a, a dispensary legal business. And, you know, connected with his daughter and doing well, you know, so it was, good because that kept getting that question like, that was always the number one question I would get whenever I would speak on a stage.

Lauren Cardillo
I it was my I mean, I read through like different excerpts and your homecoming speech, I'm like, Where's Anthony? And then I finally found you said you around. So I think it's people, just natural curiosity. They want to know, you know, how do you end up considering he took sort of a hit for you, you know?

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. Yeah. And he didn't even really remember it. You know, it was kind of just like the, you know, there was some magic and a lot of things happening in that moment, for that to happen.

Lauren Cardillo
So what for you? What do you want? The what do you want the future to be? You know, more mentors, obviously more help. But what do you see as what's your vision?

Kwame Johnson
My my big vision is to solve poverty. Not to eliminate it, because we will always have some form of poverty, but we should not be in a place in America where more than 50% of kids in public education live in poverty. We got like 55 million kids in public education. So, you know what? I hope to get a Nobel Peace Prize for one day is for solving poverty.

And the way I see that happening is through making mentorship a part of the fabric in our country, the term mentoring does not exist. In every language, you know, there's no like, equivalent for it in, in like Latin, for example. You know, so in different parts of the world, mentoring is seen as just something you do. It's like family.

So my hope is, because for me, this is bigger than big brothers and sisters. We serve a few hundred thousand kids across the country. We're the largest mentoring agency in the country, but there are millions of young people then the mentors in our country right now. So my goal is to make mentorship a part of what leaders do at some shape or form.

Like, I wish we could do like a draft where you had to be a mentor. It's simple, you know, but that would maybe be not the right way to go about it. But just what if that was something we all subscribed to? And what's another great thing about mentoring is that it brings different people together from different walks of life.

You and iron from different worlds, probably in different walks of life, but through a mentor relationship. I guarantee you learn something from me and I would learn something from you. And it's very hard to hate someone that you're in close proximity with. And I think in the divided times that we live in, mentoring can be a solution for that as well, where it brings people together from different worlds.

Where both sides get better.

Lauren Cardillo
Yeah, it builds community. Yeah. You know, I mean, if you're if you're feeling detached, it's a way to feel attached. Yeah, yeah. And I know you're in upstate New York or. No, I'm in downstate. Yeah.

Kwame Johnson
We're definitely different. You know, like that. We're definitely different.

Lauren Cardillo
People. I love when you said that cracked me up because that's an argument. You know, it's like you have poured everything into this and you have a great, positive attitude. If you hadn't found this, what? What would you be? You know what I mean? It's hard to say, but it's like you have found your calling.

Kwame Johnson
Yeah. When I got to Hampton, I had originally majored in engineering just because my brother was an engineer. And that was the only reason, you know? And then I went to business because I said, you know, I'll do something in business. And, until I met Bob, I didn't know about me. Like, this role wasn't something anyone told me about.

No one told me that I could do good and do well at the same time. So the nonprofit sector to me, I think should be taught more and spread more to, you know, young leaders so they know that this is $1 billion industry and you can give back and you can do good and do do well. So, you know, I think it was all planned out.

This is what supposed, to happen. And what I say to people is that like, you're right, you don't pick your passion and you discover it. You know, what I've learned about just different leaders is that typically your passion lies in your tragedy. Somewhere that you find who you're going to become in a, in a, in a challenge area, and that your passion comes from that.

Right? So it's kind of hard to describe, but, often people, if they really dig deep and think about who they become, if they have tapped into their passion is typically come out of some thing you've overcome in your life or some setback, and that fuels you to want to work on whatever that is and be in that space.

Lauren Cardillo
And for you, what was that setback then? It was prison.

Kwame Johnson
It was it was suicide. Your confinement, not just jail, because jail and solitary were very different things. And, it was those conversations with those young men. That's where I found it.

Lauren Cardillo
I'm glad you did. Not everybody does. They go through their life and don't find their passion. So I love that you found the passion. Yeah. So thank you so much for joining us today, Kwami. We'd love to having you share your inspiring story. It was really great. And for everybody listening and watching, please remember to like and subscribe.

If you want to hear more of these great stories from this season or last season on Unstoppable Stories, you'll find it on your preferred podcast channel. Thanks so much again, Kwami. We really enjoyed having you.

Kwame Johnson
Thank you. I'm enjoyed telling the story and go check out the book the Hope inside. It's a great read for all ages.